Westminster Hall
Wednesday 5 March 2003
[Mr. Frank Cook in the Chair]

AIDS

Mr. Robert Key (Salisbury): Of all the debates that you and I have sat through over many years, Mr. Deputy Speaker, this must have been one of the most interesting, it will present the Minister with a challenge when he makes his wind-up speech.

I congratulate the hon. Member for Edinburgh, North and Leith (Mr. Lazarowicz) for giving us another opportunity to debate this important issue, which has been debated with great success over many years. I was elected back in 1983-the dark ages of AIDS. The foundation of the all-party group on AIDS was a milestone at a time when ignorance was rife in a era of Government health programmes involving tombstones on television to impress on the public the consequences of an AIDS epidemic.

One of the first things that we had to learn was that it is no good being judgmental about AIDS and adopting a high moral tone. It is no good blaming everything on lifestyle choices, as some hon. Members did in the 1980s. One hon. Member said to me: "A plague on them; they made a choice; let them die." That was in line with wide public perceptions at the time, and it is fortunate that things have moved on.

It remains a mistake in 2003 to be judgmental about AIDS, particularly in developing countries. Being judgmental when considering such an important matter is a temptation that we should resist. We simply cannot

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apply European and American cultural stereotypes to entirely different social and cultural situations elsewhere in our world. I would like to sit some of President Bush's advisers under a mango tree in Gambia on a Saturday morning-I have done that-to talk to the village imam and elders about AIDS, contraception, family planning and so on. That usually results in uncontrollable mirth on the part of listeners and, I regret, very little comprehension.

The hon. Member for Edinburgh, North and Leith was right to discuss the consequences of the situation for the entire world, and Colin Powell was right when he said that it is as serious a threat as international terrorism. The Bush Administration's record on frustrating the work of the United Nations Population Fund is not good. I want to say to the President, as one Christian to another, that there is no evidence that the fund promoted coercive abortion in China or anywhere else. Does the President understand the consequences of his policy? The UN has estimated that cutting the USA's $34 million contribution to the fund will lead to 800,000 more unsafe abortions and the death of 4,700 mothers and 77,000 children under the age of 5. That is not a happy outcome from a change in presidential policy.

Another unfortunate consequence, particularly in countries in Africa, is that orphans are created, and there is terrible suffering and enormous medical need. Yet what do we do? We recruit their nurses for the national health service of the United Kingdom. Last year, 2,114 nurses were recruited from South Africa, 473 from Zimbabwe, 432 from Nigeria, 183 from Zambia, 195 from the Gambia, 155 from Kenya, 100 from Botswana and 75 from Malawi, in addition to the 994 recruited from India. That is not a good idea. It may be to the advantage of the nurses, and we cannot blame them for wanting to enhance their careers, but should that be the public policy of the United Kingdom Government?

My hon. Friend the Member for Banbury (Tony Baldry) referred to the UK's commitment after 2015. I wholly endorse what he said about giving the global health fund the support that it needs to persuade the European Union to match US funds. There is an EU problem in that there is increasing evidence that the American Administration seeks to influence European parliamentarians to oppose development work and, therefore, development money for southern Africa if it involves reproductive health care issues. We must take that on board very seriously.

My hon. Friend also mentioned vaccines, which are hugely important. I hope that Government agencies such as the Centre for Applied Microbiology and Research will encourage work on vaccines in partnership with our universities and their pharmaceutical partners.

The hon. Member for Clydebank and Milngavie (Tony Worthington) discussed the importance of Cairo and gave the Mozambiquan bishop's magnificent quote, which I shall use often. However, as a Christian who has a huge respect for the Roman Catholic church, I would go further and say that the best thing that could happen to it would be that it accepted married priests and women bishops very soon. They might inject a little of the sense that the hon. Member for Greenock and Inverclyde (David Cairns) introduced into our debate. The hon. Member for Caernarfon (Hywel Williams)

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discussed the huge impact on children as something that particularly affected him, and I salute him for making his comments.

The hon. Member for Greenock and Inverclyde is a Member for whom we changed the law of this land. I spoke passionately in the debate on that occasion. It was a very good debate, which I suspect the hon. Gentleman read. If he did not, he can always check my website and find it there, because I am proud of what I said and proud that I voted to change the law so that he could come along this morning to tell us how the Catholic church should be reformed and, furthermore, to do so while wearing a purple shirt. I congratulate him on that particular flourish.

The Minister must answer some serious questions. If he cannot do so now, he will in due course find someone who can. What total amount of money has our country given to the global fund? I am keen to know what our Government are doing to encourage other international donors to give more money, and our influence should be used to that effect. From where does the money for the global fund come? Is it from additional funds-perhaps from an unusually generous Chancellor of the Exchequer-or is it from the budget of the Department for International Development?

The Vice-President of Malawi, Justin Malewezi, who runs that country's campaign against AIDS, has raised a problem. He said that there is an upper ceiling for proposals and that any proposals

"over $300 million would be thrown in the bin".

Can the Minister confirm whether that is the case? Is there an upper limit on proposals for expenditure from the fund?

The commission on intellectual property rights, which is funded by DFID, is an initiative of the United Kingdom Government that I warmly welcome. Will the Minister confirm whether its report reflects official Government policy? It is important to know that, because it makes some very significant suggestions. I would be grateful if the Minister would address that issue.

In conclusion, we must not forget that we, too, are a part of the debate about the international impact of the crisis. I wish to draw the attention of the House to early-day motion 691, which is entitled "Contraceptive awareness week 2003". It points out that there is still great cause for concern in our country, in which 41,200 people are living with HIV, 31 per cent. of whom are undiagnosed. The number of people living with diagnosed HIV is rising each year. We should be careful before throwing stones in our own glass house.